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Post by John J. Stevens on Sat 06 Jul 2013, 14:07

Here are two concept missions that demonstrate the bare bone approach to creating objective based missions using all the characteristics found in any COOP mission play.

By leveraging the ANNIHILATION and INFILTRATION framework of PVP play, we can allow up to 16 players to work in COOP mode without any tether limitation to accomplish the objectives.  Additionally, there will be ONE player (usually the HOST) on the opposing PLA side that will command and manage three squads and his Body Guard(s), while regular PLA AI will defend and patrol around the objectives.

Currently the only criteria to these maps is survival and scoring while trying to find and kill the General.  Remember this is only a framework to build larger missions which remove the limitations of traditional four member COOP.

With the framework, objectives can be used to provide health, weapons, or ammo - objectives could be designed to simply create a push map.  The idea is to think about mission ideas and useful parameters that don't make it a do everything sandbox mission but one that is focused and more tactical.

So far, the INFILTRATION framework appears to be more familiar to COOP style gameplay with fixed objectives.

As always, feel free to chime in our forum to share ideas about this different level of DR mission play.

DOWNLOAD B05 and install to your /MISSION FOLDER
This is a self-extracting installer being evaluated
UPDATED 7/7/13

MORE INFO:

After it is installed - to HOST a mission:

  • RESTART Dragon Rising
  • go to MULTIPLAYER>LAN
  • CREATE SERVER for either ANNIHILATION or INFILTRATION 
  • change number of player to 17 or less 
  • select any mission prefixed with CO16+1 
  • add as many as you like (another neat thing about PVP)
  • START the SERVER!

After the server starts the HOST should assume the PLA side as GENERAL.  All other players joining in should change to USA or they will be stuck in player select screen (we are looking to see if we can move them AFTER mission starts).

HELP US SPREAD THIS IDEA - would love to hear the TUNNGLE community chime in on these concept missions


Last edited by John J. Stevens on Sun 07 Jul 2013, 17:36; edited 4 times in total


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Post by nfmz1 on Sun 07 Jul 2013, 12:08

Great job BTW checkin it out now...

Server will go up at 9 AM EST til I wake up lol


Server will be running from 
Server IP is 68.44.177.69
No password
Join VIA LAN 
I loaded both missions in and made the matches 60 minutes so HOPEFULLY it will work
I am set as PLA 
 
Let me know!!!

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Post by John J. Stevens on Sun 07 Jul 2013, 14:43

thanks for the update/server to test - no luck logging in yet - probably best to coordinate via skype/dolby/ts

Note: only ONE person can be the General it another is in the lobby they will be sitting it out with the current code.

ALSO there will be another modified version added shortly based on INFILTRATION gameplay which is more like the objective based COOP people are used to.


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Post by nfmz1 on Sun 07 Jul 2013, 14:44

Server is up @ 944Am night all! Good luck

 Time difference is  showing on Forums as 244 or so so remember that I am in a different time zone EST

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Post by John J. Stevens on Sun 07 Jul 2013, 15:05

hey guys, don't knock yourself out - this isn't a SERVER app so don't think you are going crazy if you can't log in.  These missions simply require a HOST to act as the AI GENERAL.

Please refer to the original POST for updates which will be noted!


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Post by John J. Stevens on Tue 09 Jul 2013, 10:42

Had some good tire kicking over the last few days with Dewi, Regg, Mdog, NFMZ1, Jerzy(s) and TJ - some ideas to improve the core concept

Core Code Design

  • control the respawn rate - less waves, less predictability
  • Safe ReSpawn points (multiple locations)
  • better defined objectives - less domination
  • side switcher for those lost in lobby
  • make some units defend a position while other patrol/attack
  • better Doctrine Control


Perks and other mission considerations

  • momentary SAT view for either side (as a capture prize)
  • timed ammo crate replenishing 
  • General (HOST) Hotkey squad spawner


Either case, this feedback helps - next up are the two remaining PVP play types to test  - Blindside and Supremacy.  Both of these are more territory control push style so they may be better suited to larger COOP missions.


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Post by Regg on Tue 09 Jul 2013, 22:37

Definitely sounds like you've been talking to TJ! Can't wait to "test" some of the ideas you mentioned.
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Post by oANIMUSo on Mon 11 Aug 2014, 04:03

So, what's the verdict on this one? Is this a success? I hope so, this sounds awesome!!!


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Post by John J. Stevens on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 13:33

in all honesty, this really is better served under A2/A3 build because of it larger exposed library and easy to access lobby.

either case, the big issue with ARMA is that people tend to put too much in it with way too many options - best to break it down to a squad coop with identifiable time sensitive missions.  
ARMA already has a built in spawning interface for someone to act like the general (but again they have access to everything and its unlimited) - this is where an "enemy general" interface would be valuable with limited resources and key locations to protect.


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Post by oANIMUSo on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 15:34

I was just curious if it works. More so coop matches can multitask without a tether. 

Real overwatch, or someone can go blow something up to distract enemy, while others can move in from another location. However if people were to spread out too far on a map where the island is fully populated, then a problem of entity limits could freeze the game.


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Post by John J. Stevens on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 15:55

agreed - the idea of the squad based coop would be more mission specific with truly random troop patrol, choke points, countermeasures, environment, time of day, limited ammo and loadouts to make securing a bunker 15 klicks behind enemy lines a different solution each time for the same objective, enforcing a strategic solution.  This is what I was doing with the helo insertion on the original MILTAC mission.

As for the commander/general approach - they would simply send different troops to different locations with an AWARE status, things like insert snipers at certain chokepoints and forward spotters - all very AI with the instructions.


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Post by oANIMUSo on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 16:54

John J. Stevens wrote:By leveraging the ANNIHILATION and INFILTRATION framework of PVP play, we can allow up to 16 players to work in COOP mode without any tether limitation to accomplish the objectives.

Did this work or not?


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Post by John J. Stevens on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 19:12

it did ... to a point - players needed to be aware of a general taking control then other players would fill in the US side - the general could highlight the AI and direct them in new directions and attack on their own.  As general I put a squad each west and east to do border patrol and then move the other squads up the center.  The testers like the idea of a person choosing the AI primary direction while they tried to kill the general


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Post by oANIMUSo on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 20:58

Cool!!! So, it's conceivable that someone with 2 computers could Host on one and play along side friends on the other? Not necessarily controlling anything with a general, except to open MP mission for play. Of course the host comp would still be holding the hotkeys to the mission, but the person hosting is right there to use them.


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Post by John J. Stevens on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 22:01

yes, but really the general is what makes the AI more intelligent as they would not know from what direction the squad was going to attack from and would be second guessing where to place their troops and patrols - otherwise, you might as well be playing a coop designed mission


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Post by oANIMUSo on Fri 15 Aug 2014, 22:32

So, let me get this straight. We might as well play regular coop mission with a tether as we have been? Cause, simulating the same experience without a tether, would be rubbish. Got it.


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Post by John J. Stevens on Sat 16 Aug 2014, 18:04

the coop test allowed for test two different things - 1) whether a larger coop squad could be assembled (like PVP does) - YES, it can  2)if the idea of playing against a general moving a limited amount of troops against the squad is more challenging - AGAIN YES for all parties.

We just need a more flexible environment to properly build it.


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Post by nfmz1 on Fri 22 Aug 2014, 14:48

I played a few test runs of this and it worked great and the general could set the AI's defending directions and/or direct their movements and play style (Stealth or ballsouts ect) it worked just fine and you could get more players in a game with you. But it did evolve around the General commanding the other army... kinda like Zeus for ArmA 3... lol

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